bootie beer ettiquete
Printed From: ProfessorPaddle.com
Category: General
Forum Name: Whitewater Forum
Forum Discription: Open Discussion Forum. Whitewater related subjects only
URL: http://www.professorpaddle.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=6788
Printed Date: 04 Jul 2025 at 9:44am
Topic: bootie beer ettiquete
Posted By: slickhorn
Subject: bootie beer ettiquete
Date Posted: 21 May 2008 at 4:53pm
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as a non hardsheller (and frequent swimmer) I admit to not being up on my bootie beer ettiquette. From this marvelous example of mountainbuzz angst: http://www.mountainbuzz.com/forums/f11/bout-lost-my-life-yesterday-18716.html comes this great quote "with a self rescue is, you don't have to buy anyone ice cream / beer." Can I get a vote on that? Self rescue negates bootie beers? ;-) |
Replies:
Posted By: water wacko
Date Posted: 21 May 2008 at 6:18pm
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amen. ------------- "Don't ask yourself what the world needs. Ask yourself what makes you come alive, and go do that, because what the world needs is people who have come alive." ~Howard Thurman |
Posted By: PaulGamache
Date Posted: 21 May 2008 at 8:56pm
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Gonna have to call B.S to that one.
If your bootie hits the water, expect to drink one. Whether it's from a blown skirt, pulling because your roll failed and you bailed, or you were pinned and needed to swim to escape. Fact is you swam, pay your dues.
Ultimately it comes down to an individual personal obligation to pay up. Personally if I swim kayaking taking care of the bottie is the first thing I do. Karma is a b@$*% so you might as well get it done and get it done right then and there.
Even if you self rescue the fact remains the same - you swam, handle your business. ------------- 27/320 & 1 bootie |
Posted By: Weide
Date Posted: 21 May 2008 at 9:07pm
| Again? We have to hash out the bootie beer rules again? |
Posted By: hugo
Date Posted: 21 May 2008 at 10:21pm
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Good call Paul, done a few this year...self rescue or not...drink that shit homeboy! ------------- suck it |
Posted By: STLboater
Date Posted: 22 May 2008 at 7:47am
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what if your skirt blows and yo paddle to shore with half full boat?
------------- Kayak Academy Whitewater Instructor |
Posted By: slickhorn
Date Posted: 22 May 2008 at 8:31am
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Originally posted by Weide Again? We have to hash out the bootie beer rules again? lol yes we do damnit! Ain't none of the requirements consistent post to post board to board. also, this is very much a kayaker only thing, yano? amusing. ------------- |
Posted By: Yotes
Date Posted: 22 May 2008 at 8:35am
| Paddling a swamped boat is not swimming, gordon. The rules are simple, you swim, you drink. Not like those complicated raft guide beer reward rules for rescuing other guides customers, equipment, etc... |
Posted By: Travisimo
Date Posted: 22 May 2008 at 9:56am
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Ahh yes, but what if you fall in while scouting? While getting out of your boat? I've had to rope at least one friend who slipped while getting out of his boat.
So many shades of grey. ------------- H2O please |
Posted By: paddlefoo
Date Posted: 22 May 2008 at 10:07am
| Just say NO!!! Buy beer for those that rescue you. One should never drink from a bootie!!!! |
Posted By: swimseat
Date Posted: 22 May 2008 at 10:20am
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I know that I've never heard about this, and my older (45+) kayaking buddies were the first ones paddling northwest rivers.. We always just went with "The swimmer gets the "swim-seat"," (always in the back somewhere crammed between gear and/or boats.) I'm not sure your new-fangled "fear-factor" approach is a healthy way to bust on your swimming buddy, but if you've got to do it... ------------- mixmastermax |
Posted By: swimseat
Date Posted: 22 May 2008 at 10:21am
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a round of brew sounds reasonable, though ------------- mixmastermax |
Posted By: JoesKayak
Date Posted: 22 May 2008 at 10:44am
Personally I think the whole bootie beer thing is pretty stupid. Anyone who thinks they're going to get me to suck one of those down is sorely mistaken. So you swam. OK... now go do something that will put you at risk of contracting giardia or some other nasty bug. Great idea. ![]("smileys/smiley11.gif") What does it do for the boating partners anyway, besides providing a photo-op and a chance to bust on your friend. Shit... don't most boaters bust on each other all the time as it is? PS, Fish, I'm typing this on your Mom's computer. |
Posted By: Guests
Date Posted: 22 May 2008 at 11:25am
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I've have never drank a bootie and never will, whether I swim or not. It is a stupid and pointless tradition.
Maybe instead of assuming that drinking out of a bootie will save you from river karma, you should take a look at your skills, look at what did wrong, and figure out what you can do better next time. ------------- |
Posted By: swimseat
Date Posted: 22 May 2008 at 11:41am
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maybe the purpose of this foul tradition is prove once and for all that paddlers are the biggest badasses around. badass like: "We don't care if we're stuck on the shitter for a month! We're badasses!" sorry, had to do some more busting on my fellow man. ------------- mixmastermax |
Posted By: Ellingferd
Date Posted: 22 May 2008 at 11:43am
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good lord people. if you dont want to drink a bootie beer dont. if you would like to adhere to the tradition, do. there you go.
as for giardia, that is a ridiculous claim. i am tired of river people being simultaneous giardia freaks. think about how much river water you have near your mouth, and swallowed, or have shoved up your nose, etc, then go back to the reasoning that drinking out of a bootie will give you giardia. ingesting river water is a fact of kayaking whether you are trying to or not, and if you paddle the wenatchee, who knows what kinds of goodies are in that water.
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Posted By: James
Date Posted: 22 May 2008 at 11:47am
Better than doing a bootie beer on the columbia ![]("smileys/smiley34.gif")
------------- |
Posted By: Tobin
Date Posted: 22 May 2008 at 11:52am
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New Tradition;
If you swim and 1 peorson gets you and all your gear to shore, you MUST drink from THEIR bootie!!!
------------- Sure? |
Posted By: JoesKayak
Date Posted: 22 May 2008 at 11:55am
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Originally posted by Ellingferd good lord people. if you dont want to drink a bootie beer dont. if you would like to adhere to the tradition, do. there you go. as for giardia, that is a ridiculous claim. i am tired of river people being simultaneous giardia freaks. think about how much river water you have near your mouth, and swallowed, or have shoved up your nose, etc, then go back to the reasoning that drinking out of a bootie will give you giardia. ingesting river water is a fact of kayaking whether you are trying to or not, and if you paddle the wenatchee, who knows what kinds of goodies are in that water. No it's not ridiculous. I have been lucky so far, but I do know boaters who have contracted giardia from incidental water intake while boating. And that is just one bug of many that are out there... and we're not even talking about free flowing water here... this is from a bootie... a wet, enclosed, pourous environment, that is also kept warm from body heat.... why do you think old booties smell bad? They are a great place for all kinds of bacteria, fungii, etc to grow. You'd get less germs by taking body shots off Courtney Love. |
Posted By: swimseat
Date Posted: 22 May 2008 at 12:12pm
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we paddled the cascade last year early in the season and my old man ran low on water. I offered him some of mine, but he said he didn't want to waste it. He waded out and filled his bottle under the cool, clear, rushing current and made a joke about giardia. His next three weeks were spent on the toilet. You'd better watch your back, Ellingferd. we don't joke about the beaver fever. ------------- mixmastermax |
Posted By: slickhorn
Date Posted: 22 May 2008 at 12:20pm
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After a 10 day Main Salmon float, my brother's nausea and balance
problems were diagnosed as giardia, despite all tests being negative. Turned out to be a brain tumor. ![]("smileys/smiley42.gif") How's that for funny? True story. He had a hell of time with it, but he's now in his final quarter at Gonzaga getting his Nursing degree, and doing great. ------------- |
Posted By: Ellingferd
Date Posted: 22 May 2008 at 1:22pm
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i am certainly not advocating filling up a nalgene, drink the water from the river free for all. however, i think you are just as likely to get giardia by engaging in the act of kayaking as you are by drinking out of a bootie. while the bootie may be a more concentrated source of bacteria, probably not a more concentrated source of giardia. if it were, it still wouldnt be significant as you spend more time in the river than you do drinking out of your bootie, unless you swim every time you roll over and your bootie has been placed next to your pint glass.
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Posted By: James
Date Posted: 22 May 2008 at 2:47pm
I should not be proud of this but I have drank from most likely the
nastiest booties around, I have even had people volunteer LOL er forced ,, to drink from them and no giardia or other illnesses to report. If you
find a nastier set of booties let me know cause I have yet to see them.![]("/uploads/bin/2/useruploads/29/662tn600.jpg") reMember that Ryan? ------------- |
Posted By: STLboater
Date Posted: 22 May 2008 at 4:20pm
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Originally posted by James Better than doing a bootie beer on the columbia
or the Mississippi ------------- Kayak Academy Whitewater Instructor |
Posted By: Weide
Date Posted: 22 May 2008 at 4:32pm
| Blah, blah, blah! |
Posted By: hugo
Date Posted: 22 May 2008 at 4:50pm
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Here it goes again, quit being such cry baby bitches...if you don't want to booty up, then don't, end of story. It does not pertain to you, so nobody cares what you think. I have come to expect that sort of whinning from KTW, but from the rest of you...good lord. Cry, cry, cry...all the way home. Hugo
Hugo ------------- suck it |
Posted By: ashleygoesdisco
Date Posted: 22 May 2008 at 6:29pm
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Originally posted by hugo I have come to expect that sort of whinning from KTW thats real nice, Hugo. if anyone is whining, he isnt the only one. i didnt say anything on the subject yet, but if i had, it would be similar. so what. ------------- Ashley Duffus Well behaved women rarely make history. www.naiyadays.blogspot.com |
Posted By: bseracka
Date Posted: 22 May 2008 at 6:30pm
| If I recall Paddler did a bacteria sample and assessed the dangers of shooting the boot a few issues ago. If I remember correctly the bootie smell comes from yeast (you know the ingreent that makes beer, beer) and the bacteria count was lower than a keyboard. |
Posted By: hugo
Date Posted: 22 May 2008 at 8:13pm
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Originally posted by ashleygoesdisco
thats real nice, Hugo. if anyone is whining, he isnt the only one. i didnt say anything on the subject yet, but if i had, it would be similar. so what. Too bad, nobody cares what you think crashley. Besides, from the sounds of it, you owe more than a couple of booty beers to even the score from last weekend...
atych yew gee oh! ------------- suck it |
Posted By: ashleygoesdisco
Date Posted: 22 May 2008 at 8:55pm
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nobody has to care. you are just being a jerk, like usual. i appreciate it. my opinion, yep, it probably stinks. thanks for making my hectic day better with your ever edifying comments. and yeah, probably. but its not going to happen. i was sufficiently freaked out, and no one will be making me drink for what happened. they can try, it wont work. ------------- Ashley Duffus Well behaved women rarely make history. www.naiyadays.blogspot.com |
Posted By: hugo
Date Posted: 22 May 2008 at 10:03pm
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Ashleygoesswimming, nobody is making you do anything...and that is just it. You choose not to partake in this tradition (which is just fine with us) so nobody gives a shit about what you have to say. I imagine that you do not play ice hockey either...do you bitch to the NHL whenever there is a rule that you don't like? ------------- suck it |
Posted By: ashleygoesdisco
Date Posted: 22 May 2008 at 10:07pm
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haaaha. NHL. HA. i keep my nose out of such things. i just dont like the way that you commented on what KTW said. i think its a valid point though, for a couple of us who dont partake, to post in this thread about why. and i dont think we need any shit for it. i wasnt bitching about the tradition. i was defending someone who has a similar view as i do. and thanks. swam competitively for six years. =) ------------- Ashley Duffus Well behaved women rarely make history. www.naiyadays.blogspot.com |
Posted By: hugo
Date Posted: 22 May 2008 at 10:24pm
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whatever...sorry to hurt your feelings. ------------- suck it |
Posted By: PaulGamache
Date Posted: 22 May 2008 at 11:03pm
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Bringing it back again.
If you don't partake in the tradition then you really don't have an opinion on the matter... It's like raft guiding you swim you buy beer, if you don't buy beer when you swim guiding you shouldn't drink from the communial beers. Same w/ kayaking, you swim you drink a bootie, if you don't drink a bootie when you swim your opinion on the tradition doesn't matter nor do you get to tell people they owe a bootie, plain and simple. Personally, I could care less if someone doesn't want to drink a bottie if they swim. Traditions are the few things that hold communities together, it creates great stories, pictures, bonding etc. If you want to seperate yourself from that feel free no one is pressuring you to be a part of it. The reason for the bottie is to pay homage to the river for allowing you to get back to your dry clothes and vehicle. If anyone wants to deny this respect that's their deal, personally I look forward to saying thanks and moving on w/ my paddling. The comments about giardia and bootie beers are some of the more unfound reasons to not own up that I have ever heard. I've had giardia twice now, it sucks, but to say you can get it from drinking botties is just absurd.
James I've got a pair that will match yours I'd be down to have a bootie off comparing the two. Your's actually look more legit due to the duct tape but mine have plants growing out of the toes. ------------- 27/320 & 1 bootie |
Posted By: Guests
Date Posted: 23 May 2008 at 7:50am
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Blah blah blah
Its easy to say 'don't participate if you don't want to.' On the otherhand, peer pressure, that many of you exhibit, to participate in this tradition is immense. Also, the idea that 'I drank a booty so everything is ok' doesnt sing to me. Its a good thing I don't care what you think, Hugo. ------------- |
Posted By: Guests
Date Posted: 23 May 2008 at 8:01am
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Paul, your post is a perfect example of the pressure I'm talking about. Good thing you don't speak for everyone and don't actually represent the community that I don't get to be a part of if I don't follow along with you. ------------- |
Posted By: arnobarno
Date Posted: 23 May 2008 at 8:31am
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KTW, Once again, like Seattle in general and Professor Paddle specifically, we see how diversity (of opinion) is nurtured and respected. Err, that is, as long as you agree with the politically correct/vocal opinion. ------------- arn9schaeffer@gmail.com (remove 9 for my real email address) |
Posted By: hugo
Date Posted: 23 May 2008 at 9:04am
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Seriously, We do not care if others do it. I do it and my friends do it, I have never, nor will ever pressure somebody into doing it. Arn, this thread was about guidelines of a tradition. If that tradition does not pertain to you, then you have no say in the matter. Lets say that I wanted some beta on Robe, or the Clear Fork of the Cowlitz or the Little White, would you or Ashley or Jose or KTW have any worhwhile beta to give us? Probably not, unless you have been down there and done it for yourself. ------------- suck it |
Posted By: PaulGamache
Date Posted: 23 May 2008 at 9:08am
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KTW,
Bro I've got friends I paddle w/ that also choose not to drink from booties. It's really not a big deal at all, if you don't want to participate that's fine man NO ONE IS PRESSURING YOU.
Sounds like you've got some buddies or other paddlers that are pretty annoying about trying to get you to drink one, sorry if what I said brought back shivers of peer pressure on you.
The part about traditions was a mention on swimming being a noteworthy aspect of paddling, the bootie commemorates that. If you don't like that tradition fine, come up w/ something else but at the end of the day when people are hanging out and someone asks "so did anyone swim" have something for people to do or partake in.
Also remember that you don't need to drink beer from a bottie to have it count, if someone doesn't want to drink beer that's totally cool also. Tim last weekend on the Clackamas drank a Viso from his bottie.
This whole thing really is more effort than it's worth, making a way bigger deal out of drinking a bottie, and making serious something that's intended to be fun.
Hell, sometimes I'll swim on purpose just so I know I'll get a free beer at the end of the day. It's all those non-swimmers who are the real suckers, ha! ------------- 27/320 & 1 bootie |
Posted By: slickhorn
Date Posted: 23 May 2008 at 9:12am
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I think as forum trolls go ... Hugo is the most asinine poster I've seen in a loooong time. I see that I'm lucky to not have to worry about bootie beers since I'm not a bad ass enough to be dropping into Clear Fork, Robe, Ernies, etc. I have never realized the imporant connection between bootie beers, class V and decency. Thank god we have Hugo here to educate all of us! We are SOOOO LUCKY! Thanks Hugo! Nothing like a friendly, civil community to make ya proud of your sport. Jackass. ------------- |
Posted By: PowWrangler
Date Posted: 23 May 2008 at 9:22am
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Arn, you're subtle comments on political philosophy, no matter how unrelated they are to the topic at hand, always entertain me.
![]("http://www.professorpaddle.com/forum/smileys/smiley2.gif") I'm counting about three people in this thread that are espousing the "pc" version of booty drinking.I guess it comes down to how impressionable you are and what "vibes" you pick up on and who you boat with. I've never felt pressured into drinking a beer and have probably only drank five in my life (even though I've swam a lot more than that).
You can thank the Montana Guidebook/TGR boys for starting the tradition back in the late nineties. For those of you put off by alcohol, you can always imbibe in the "ice cream rules" recently started by the Colorado folks. |
Posted By: arnobarno
Date Posted: 23 May 2008 at 9:40am
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I have no opinion that I want to share on the subject of booty beers. I do have an opinion on civility on public forums though. Especially where people often know each other in real life. Asking about etiquette, to me, includes a wide range of answers and it seems appropriate for people to include opinions related to proper form as well as risks/social pressure/ etc. that are associated with said etiquette/tradition and how it makes them feel. I appreciate seeing the different opinions and I don't like the bullying tactics that are often used to suppress them. arn PS Dave, Glad I could provide some entertainment value if nothing else! First time I was accused of being subtle though! ![]("smileys/smiley1.gif") ------------- arn9schaeffer@gmail.com (remove 9 for my real email address) |
Posted By: hugo
Date Posted: 23 May 2008 at 9:53am
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Slicky, you are missing my point. The same argument applies, that example can be used for any river, if you haven't done it, chances are, you should not be giving beta. It could be class I or class II or class III or class IV or class V. If you don't drink the booty, then nothing you say is of concern to the interested parties, this thread was about clarifying rules, not crying about traditions you don't like. ------------- suck it |
Posted By: Guests
Date Posted: 23 May 2008 at 10:22am
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Paul-
I have never felt pressure to drink a bootie, I have not had the opportunity for a little over 6.5 years. My point is that I have seen people pressured into it. Maybe I misread your post but from what I read, you said that this tradition ties communities together and that if you don't partake you are separating yourself from the community. I feel like that statement is blatant peer pressure. To restate my other point, I feel that many people use the bootie as a way to ignore their swims. "I drank beer out of neoprene so I am OK now, everything is in the past." I think that a lot of times swims should be analyzed a little more and you should realize that skill assessment (and improvement based on that assessment) is what will stop you from swimming again. ------------- |
Posted By: ashleygoesdisco
Date Posted: 23 May 2008 at 10:31am
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Originally posted by hugo whatever...sorry to hurt your feelings. thanks Hugo. ![]("smileys/smiley9.gif") ------------- Ashley Duffus Well behaved women rarely make history. www.naiyadays.blogspot.com |
Posted By: JoesKayak
Date Posted: 23 May 2008 at 11:08am
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Originally posted by arnobarno I have no opinion that I want to share on the subject of booty beers. I do have an opinion on civility on public forums though. Especially where people often know each other in real life. Asking about etiquette, to me, includes a wide range of answers and it seems appropriate for people to include opinions related to proper form as well as risks/social pressure/ etc. that are associated with said etiquette/tradition and how it makes them feel. I appreciate seeing the different opinions and I don't like the bullying tactics that are often used to suppress them. arn PS Dave, Glad I could provide some entertainment value if nothing else! First time I was accused of being subtle though! Thanks for an excellent post. I'm done with this thread... not because I don't have points to bring up on the subject, but because of the tone this thread has taken. I have better things to do, like plan my next boating trips, than get into pointless online arguments. And yes, I realize the way I worded my first post could have rubbed someone who does partake in BBs the wrong way, and if I did, I'm sorry. Everyone have a great MD weekend... boat safe and don't swim... whether you do BB's or not. |
Posted By: swimseat
Date Posted: 23 May 2008 at 11:15am
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ahahahaha oh my goodness I just want to start off by saying thank god.
I love how this thread escalated into madness. I'm new to the site, and I could not envision a more positive representation of the paddling community, sans one user. It's ok to stand by your tradition and it's ok to defend your position; I think the only real problem here is one individual calling people out on a public thread in an (obvious) attempt to bring them down. shame on you hugo, I don't care if you're a tsangpo paddler; there is nothing cool about bashing other people because of the whitewater they choose to paddle. that's just lame. and busting on ashley because she swam the other day at high flows? lame again. your negative attitude and your (obvious) desire to hurt other peoples' feelings don't do anyone any good. ------------- mixmastermax |
Posted By: PaulGamache
Date Posted: 23 May 2008 at 11:32am
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Wow, no swims in 6.5 years. That's pretty impressive, not being sarcastic. To reitterate, no one should pressue anyone into drinking booties, or running the gnar, or any other BS that someone doesn't want to do. To go back to what this thread was about in the first place. If you play the bootie game and you swim whether you self rescue or not, under the rules of the game, you are a canadite for a bootie. I actually just drank one in my kitchen because I like doing them so much. ------------- 27/320 & 1 bootie |
Posted By: hugo
Date Posted: 23 May 2008 at 12:14pm
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swimseat, I am not calling anybody out, nor am i a tsangpo paddler (not sure where you got that idea). GIve me one example from this thread on how i am picking on people because of their choice of whitewater.
I people don't want to be called out, then they stay out of a conversation that has nothing to do with them, or if they do decide to grace us with their irrelevant opinions, then they should be prepared to deal with the responses.
I was wrong to pick on ashley for swimming. that was lame, but she is tough and can handle it. did i not mention in the beginning of this thread that i too have had a few booties this season? simmer down
------------- suck it |
Posted By: jondufay
Date Posted: 23 May 2008 at 12:38pm
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james, I remember that picture -just before ryan (sorry to call you out in such a public forum) and I drank rouge stout from them. because i swim alot, i end up doing a lot booty beers, it gets easier with time. I am fairly sure that i have quite a layer of river sediment in my guts. i raise a can of old chub right now in hopes that i will not have to do one this weekend.KTW, do you really know people that think that just because they drank a beer from their booty, they are protected? sounds obsurd and don't know any other bootier that thinks that.
Jon
see everybody this weekend and i look forward to hanging with lots of good paddling buds that i don't see too much anymore.
------------- ahh, f--- it dude, lets go boating... |
Posted By: cloudpeak
Date Posted: 23 May 2008 at 2:19pm
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I'm just curious. This question is for Paul. What's the proper bootie etiquette when you're in your boat and fall off highway overpasses, crash going down stairs, or beater in the snow? Funny videos, BTW. lol
I just felt the need to be part of this important thread. Have a great weekend everyone. |
Posted By: kebm1979
Date Posted: 24 May 2008 at 4:53pm
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The bootie is part of the tradition among friends, not a requirement of boating and the sport. If i am with peeps I don't normally paddle with I probably won't mention a bootie to them, but if it's my bests buds and I'm in reasonable boatin shape I expect the bootie to probably be called. That said I did have a nasty bacteria illness a number of years ago from drinking a bootie. I have had giardia too, but that was just from nasty bolivian water not a bootie. the bacteria was worse as it was flying out both ends for a couple of days. those babies are now the major stench of a laidfill close to home. lesson learned: booties can be okay, but troublesome too keeping booties clean, v. important ------------- Everyday has at least one happy hour |
Posted By: Courtney
Date Posted: 24 May 2008 at 6:02pm
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A couple of hypothetical questions:
If your booties are sucked off during your swim and they aren't recovered, what do you do? Is there a grace period so that you can partake of the tradition when new booties are purchased, or must you use the booties that were in use during the swim?
What if you fully intend to partake of the booty tradition, but your idiot kayaking friends did not bring beer to the river (in that case are they actually friends?), how much time can pass before the act booty beering is negated and does not help your river karma? Must you drive like hell to the nearest store and get some beer before the time limit runs out? What if you are in a dry county in North Carolina and the nearest beer store is 80 miles away?
What if none of your paddling partners agree with the booty beer and think it spreads disease and such, but you feel you must right the karma imbalance by having one, but they pitch a total fit that you are going to kill yourself? Is it bad manners to have a booty beer in such company?
What if your booty has holes in it and a lot of beer spills on the ground, does that really count as a booty beer, or is that like sort of having a booty beer?
If you wear socks inside of your booties but your friends don't, do they restore more river karma by bootying than you do?
If you have a gag reflex while bootying and upchuck, does that increase the bad karma more than if you had just not bootied? Or if you gag reflex, but suck it back down and finish the booty, do you gain river godness status?
The only booty I believe in doing belongs to my wife, so I guess I didn't really have a right to ask the above questions. Feel free to flog me next you see me.
Jimmy
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Posted By: paddlefoo
Date Posted: 24 May 2008 at 9:32pm
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Hugo You opinion is actually the irrelevant one. You claim that those who do not booty should not have an opinion. That would be great if we lived in a bubble. The fact of the matter is that the whitewater community is very small and everything that we all do, at times, affects everyone else...or at least has the potential to do so. That being said, drinking anything from soiled booties gives you and the rest of of us in the whitewater community a bad name. There is a reason we have all heard the term "dirt bag boater" and other fun variations of that term. While amusing at times, it doesn't really help when we are trying to make progress to open up access to runs, gain recreational releases and have influence with the greater society at large in other ways. As a small community...your "tradition" doesn't help our cause(s). Paddle Safe |