Whitewater Forum: A request for topics for Doug Ammons....

A request for topics for Doug Ammons....

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Topic: A request for topics for Doug Ammons....

Posted By: inbetweenswims
Subject: A request for topics for Doug Ammons....
Date Posted: 20 Nov 2010 at 5:27pm

I'm looking for questions for Doug Ammons....

Whitewater explorer and author, Doug Ammons, has agreed to sit down for an interview for the 'In Between Swims' podcast in the next few weeks. (He'll be coming through DC in early December.) While there's plenty I can talk with him about, I want to solicit questions and conversation items from the larger boating community. I did this last year with EJ (http://inbetweenswims.libsyn.com/a_conv ... ic_jackson) and got several great suggestions that were used on the show.

This time, it's Doug Ammons turn. Have a question about running the Stikine solo? The Amazon? Maybe an item from 'Whitewater Philosophy' or "The Laugh of the Water Nymph?" Or his views on current paddling culture? This is a great opportunity to get feedback from one of the definitive paddlers in our sport.

Drop me a note at inbetweenswims@yahoo or post here - and let me know what you'd like to hear Ammons speak about.....

Thanks for listening....

~jeffmc

Replies:

Posted By: franzhorner
Date Posted: 22 Nov 2010 at 11:16am

I would ask him where his first trips were that got him comfy in class V. I would also ask him what was his burliest or scariest swim early in his paddling career. One other question might be whether he can still appreciate a long boat with lots of hull speed....

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MORE RAIN PLEASE

Posted By: STLboater
Date Posted: 22 Nov 2010 at 12:06pm

How does he feel about the progression in big BIG drops. EX: Palouse and the future of pushing the vertical limit. This is especially interesting because no one has endured serious injury pushing the WR limit (as far as I know)

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Kayak Academy Whitewater Instructor

Posted By: jP
Date Posted: 23 Nov 2010 at 10:29am

Well I'm generally interested in anything the man has to day about whitewater boating. His accomplishments are enough that they have yet to slightly fade next to the current cutting edge's ("young" guns') accomp[lishments.

Brian- Ammons did dpeak out in favor of an open ended system (add numbers: class VI, VII, ect.) One of the only high profile people to do so that I'm aware of. I would ask him to ellaborate on that.

Franz and Gordon: I can't speak for Ammons himself but here's what I'd imagine he'd say to both of your comments:

-Probly N. Fork Payette: to get "comfy" on class V and gnarliest swim. Not sure though. Also not sure about his boat design preferences.

-He's said various things about big waterfalls, but he certainly acknowledges that it is one of the frontiers of the sport, as well as big water class V, where the Stikine still sits firmly planted as one of the pinnacles on the planet for such. Of course people will be asking about this and his responses will undoubtly be of great interest. Can't wait.

I'm going to ask about the rating system, because it goes hand in hand with the progression of the sport and I think to endlessly compress stuff into class V is silly. That people have changed the meaning of class VI to mean "unrunnable" when it explicitly stated in writing that it was "not meant to decribe drops that (were) unrunable".

If AW officially changed the definition of class VI when did occur?

Seems like they went in the wrong direction in coming up with a new definition. Today's Tylers. Rushes, Bens and Taos or whatever you want to call them tomorrow (Wells Brothers? Dane Jackson?) are running MORE class VI. Not less. I sure as hell ain't running any class VI! Never will.

But just because they are running class VI doesn't mean that all I and all the other "liesure class V boaters" run anymore is class IV because they don't want to call a class VI for what it really is. The river isn't any different. Gravity is the same and sh*t flows downhill same as ever. River classifications shouldn't downgrade because of equipment and skill advancements, or because someone came along and had the courage to huck their heuvos over that which was previously unhucked. Dig?

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🐋🐋🐋🐋🐋🐋🐋🐋🐋🐋🐋

Posted By: James
Date Posted: 23 Nov 2010 at 11:01am

I would ask him what he thinks about the boating community in general.

Specifically going into the fact that he has been around much of the pioneering of the sport and although it will always continue he has a unique perspective to see how communities and regions have grown, shrunk and what he thinks they will do in the future. Why and If he even thinks it is relevant... Did the growth benefit, detract or play a neutral role?

Posted By: Jed Hawkes
Date Posted: 23 Nov 2010 at 3:50pm

Along the lines of the rapid classification: The idea of a rapid being called a "class IV-V" rapid. For example; 20 footer on robe canyon is called class IV-V on the river page. Are we using this because it is dependent on water level, skill level, or some other variable? I can buy III+ or V- but IV-V seems like too broad of a brush to paint with. Additionally if one follows the definition it would be impossible for a rapid to be class IV and V simultaneously.

Maybe not ask a question that wordy, but include it in a similar question.

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The line will become apparent
978-273-7723

Posted By: Jed Hawkes
Date Posted: 23 Nov 2010 at 3:51pm

By the way, love the podcast Jeff, keep up the good work.

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The line will become apparent
978-273-7723

Posted By: Ellingferd
Date Posted: 23 Nov 2010 at 3:57pm

personally, and not to start a debate on the ratings for robe, i think that pretty much every major rapid on robe (tunnels, last sunshine, hotel cali, faceplant, catchers, garbage, 20 ft, off broadway, conversation, ms. robs) are all the definition of standard class five. Just like there are rapids AW uses to define ratings (I believe boulder drop is used to define IV). This is at normal water levels of course (5.1-5.8). To call 20 ft IV-V is a bit misleading since it has one of the worst spots on the run when you are at the second boof (look to your left the next time you are there, not the nicest looking sieve).

As for questions for Ammons, I would like to hear about the Stikine mostly.

Posted By: inbetweenswims
Date Posted: 23 Nov 2010 at 4:30pm

Really great suggestions and conversation! This is exactly the sort of feedback I was hoping for.

Thanks everyone - I could probably fill the episode from these postings alone.

Please continue....

~jeffmc

Posted By: inbetweenswims
Date Posted: 30 Nov 2010 at 10:48am

Thanks Brian - The packrafting idea has come up before in different contexts. I talked to the guys at Backpacking Light a few years ago at OR - they seem to really be the lead on covering this.

My show is scheduled for the next couple of months but I hope to follow up and do a piece on packrafting sometime in the upcoming season.

Meanwhile, I'll see if I can get Doug's impressions....

Thanks again for all the great feedback!

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In Between Swims:The Whitewater Podcast
http://www.inbetweenswims.com

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