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Otter Boy
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  Quote Otter Boy Replybullet Topic: Howard Hanson Dam
    Posted: 24 Jun 2009 at 11:16am
Things could get interesting this winter.

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/localnews/2009376179_leakingdam24m.html
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  Quote Tobin Replybullet Posted: 24 Jun 2009 at 12:22pm
Sweet!
Sure?
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  Quote James Replybullet Posted: 24 Jun 2009 at 1:48pm
I have a feeling there are a few paddlers in the valley that this is more Bittersweet for.

I'm on a hill so I'm all for it, we could make a new friday night activity called the Renton Bar Float. Assuming that they stay open ... could be the newest rage!
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  Quote Otter Boy Replybullet Posted: 24 Jun 2009 at 2:04pm
Yeah. You gotta feel for property owners in the Green River valley, but there are known hazards of building in a flood plain.
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  Quote BRoss Replybullet Posted: 24 Jun 2009 at 2:10pm
hmm, i think now is the perfect time for AW to negotiate recreational releases, *solely for the dam's benefit*
"That boated a lot better than it looked." "It always does until it doesn't."
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  Quote water wacko Replybullet Posted: 24 Jun 2009 at 2:19pm
I read somewhere that historic flows pre-Hanson were 30,000-50,000, and they built the dam to keep the flood plain in tact for farmers.
"Don't ask yourself what the world needs. Ask yourself what makes you come alive, and go do that, because what the world needs is people who have come alive." ~Howard Thurman
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  Quote dave Replybullet Posted: 24 Jun 2009 at 9:26pm
Wow, I read that article...the dam is leaking and they don't know why? They patched it back in 2002 and it doesn't seem to be working? sounds like they need to rebuild the dam completely and do it right this time.

I told people at work because our shop is down in Auburn and they thought I was crazy! They wont think I am crazy when I'm paddling away after it floods this winter and they are swimming!!! I will be bringing my boat to work just in case...
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  Quote Otter Boy Replybullet Posted: 24 Jun 2009 at 10:01pm
Wow, 30-50k! I'd like to see that going through the gorge.
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  Quote JoesKayak Replybullet Posted: 25 Jun 2009 at 10:02am
Originally posted by water wacko

I read somewhere that historic flows pre-Hanson were 30,000-50,000, and they built the dam to keep the flood plain in tact for farmers.



That seems accurate to me. From what I remember of last January's floods that brought the reservoir up to the record level, the input to Howard Hanson reservoir peaked somewhere around 25K. Plus, at some points for flood protection they were releasing only 2-3K from the dam, but the flow in Auburn was up to 10K, so there was an additional 7000 cfs or so coming in from tributaries downstream of the dam. That would mean a total flow of over 30,000 would have been coming through Kent and Tukwila last January if it weren't for the dam. And it only takes about 12K before the river overtops levees in the Kent valley.


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  Quote water wacko Replybullet Posted: 25 Jun 2009 at 10:20am
nd remember the Corps redirected the Green and Cedar to flow into the Duwamish back in the day so they could lower Lake WA 30 feet. They used to flow into Lake WA. I wonder what would happen if the dam wasn't there anymore.
"Don't ask yourself what the world needs. Ask yourself what makes you come alive, and go do that, because what the world needs is people who have come alive." ~Howard Thurman
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  Quote cronar Replybullet Posted: 25 Jun 2009 at 10:42am
Actually they didn't redirect the Green, Brett.  It never flowed into Lake Washington to begin with.  The outflow of Lake Washington was the Black River which met up with the Green and became the Duwamish.  see link: http://www.historylink.org/index.cfm?DisplayPage=output.cfm&file_id=2624
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  Quote water wacko Replybullet Posted: 25 Jun 2009 at 10:55am
very cool link. i never knew about the Black River.
"Don't ask yourself what the world needs. Ask yourself what makes you come alive, and go do that, because what the world needs is people who have come alive." ~Howard Thurman
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  Quote James Replybullet Posted: 25 Jun 2009 at 11:36am
That's pretty sad about Henry Moses just watching as the river dried up and his tribes lives were changed. "That was quite a day for the white people at least". Pretty amazing statement, although now a days it would be more like "Quite an amazing day for profits and commerce". Still he got a pool named after him so there should be no hard feelings!!!! 
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  Quote dave Replybullet Posted: 25 Jun 2009 at 12:37pm
I was reading through some history and came across this.

On January 6, 1917, Pierce County residents vote to bond themselves for $2 million dollars to purchase 70,000 acres of land on the Nisqually plains at American Lake. The land will then be turned over to the federal government free of charge for development into a military post. The facility is called Camp Lewis.

Funny how the Federal government has now fenced off all this land and will prosecute anyone who sets foot on the land that we donated to that Government. How soon they forget the charity of its citizens...
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  Quote dave Replybullet Posted: 25 Jun 2009 at 1:44pm
Since we are on history,

Do these falls still exist?



Cedar Falls on the Cedar.
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  Quote dblanchard Replybullet Posted: 25 Jun 2009 at 1:50pm
If they don't exist any more, I wonder who made the final descent, or whether they were ever run.

D
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  Quote Travisimo Replybullet Posted: 25 Jun 2009 at 1:59pm
Pretty sure they do... I even heard a little birdie talking about trying to run them...

Problem is they are on land that is protected by the watershed so access is an issue...


...and that's all I has to say about that...
H2O please
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  Quote JoesKayak Replybullet Posted: 25 Jun 2009 at 2:07pm
Yes, they exist, but they are in the city of Seattle watershed and hidden behind it's barbed wire and armed guards... I thought I heard that Tao had run one or both at some point, but that's just a rumor.
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  Quote James Replybullet Posted: 25 Jun 2009 at 2:10pm
Its not just an issue it is a serious federal offense enforced by patrolling aircraft, trucks, and GPS equipped cedar river pigeons wearing video harnesses and small FFEDs.

I don't think I would mess around back there...
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  Quote water wacko Replybullet Posted: 25 Jun 2009 at 3:08pm
Toa ran both. It's in a Twitch vid.
"Don't ask yourself what the world needs. Ask yourself what makes you come alive, and go do that, because what the world needs is people who have come alive." ~Howard Thurman
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  Quote James Replybullet Posted: 25 Jun 2009 at 3:38pm
How did he evade the pigeons ?
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  Quote water wacko Replybullet Posted: 25 Jun 2009 at 4:01pm
bird shot...
"Don't ask yourself what the world needs. Ask yourself what makes you come alive, and go do that, because what the world needs is people who have come alive." ~Howard Thurman
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  Quote water wacko Replybullet Posted: 25 Jun 2009 at 4:03pm
Does FFED stand for flapping fowl electronic devices? 
"Don't ask yourself what the world needs. Ask yourself what makes you come alive, and go do that, because what the world needs is people who have come alive." ~Howard Thurman
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  Quote Ik'er Replybullet Posted: 25 Jun 2009 at 5:58pm
Originally posted by dave

Since we are on history,

Do these falls still exist?



Cedar Falls on the Cedar.
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  Quote Ik'er Replybullet Posted: 25 Jun 2009 at 6:04pm
I found a recent picture somewhere of at least one of the "cedar falls" it was a just a trickle and didnt show another falls in the picture, so who knows. I stumbled into the watershed years ago on a bicycle and found some interesting concrete bunkers marked "Danger-Explosives" and of course the beautiful clear water of the upper Cedar without any grungy boaters :)
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