Hey All:

I've heard a murmur or two about dry-pants taking on more than a bit of water during long, punishing swims before now, but recently "flooded" dry-pants have been brought up as a possible contributor to Jim O'Brien's death via flush drowning on Hubbard Brook (Western Mass) back in March/April.

Just for the sake of background, if there was one guy who was "The Man" when it came to creeking in the greater Western Mass area it was JIm, and the fact that he died in a hydraulic on a run that he'd done at least a few dozen times before, that was waaay below his top-end abilities, despite the best efforts of two equally rock-solid boaters to save him shook up everyone in that scene pretty badly.

Anyhow - now that the details associated with Jim's death have begun to emerge, and flooded dry-pants have emerged as one of many potential contributors to his death - along with extreme cold and a number of other factors - I thought I'd cross post the thread here and ask anyone with first-hand knowledge if they've ever experienced anything like a bad swim made worse by drypants taking on excess water or have heard of anything along those lines.

I converted to a drysuit a few years ago and don't see myself ever going back, and this could be a one-off event, but if this is a potential downside of this piece of gear, it's worth talking about IMO.

http://www.npmb.com/cms2/e107_plugins/forum/forum_viewtopic.php?157626.0

I have dry pants with ankle gaskets that I've never had problems with. Never had a lick of water get in them. Will only get damp around my stomach/waist if I swim. I always push the air out of them as much as I can. I've never been caught in a hydraulic when wearing them, only when wearing shorts.

That's some tragic stuff...  RIP Jim O'Brian

I have a pair of these and spend a lot of time wading / swimming in them teaching and I stay very dry.
On a really long swim I did get a little wet around the waste but no accumulation.
Wading teaching rolls up to my waste and bone dry - good pants!

I had a gnarly swim in my early days that I am convinced was made worse by not only drypants but also a low float jacket.  It was guide training and I was wearing some fleece pants and tops with dry pants and a splash top.  Our trainer was guiding for Boulder Drop and we hit the biggest rock in the entrance, way left of where you would normally go in what some people call the "lemming chute".  We flipped on that rock and eventually I was flushed over the ledge that goes back into the bubble pool above the picket fence.  Everyone else got out river left.  After I swam over the picket fence I did not come to the surface until AFTER flypaper rock.  At times it felt like there were rocks above me and below me and it never seemed like I had enough float to surface.  When I did make it to shore my drypants were full of water up past my knees.  All my fleece was soaked and i was sure I needed more flotation in my life along with less water in pants....

Really useful thread, I never heard anything before about the possibility of dry pants filling up. I know some people have had no problems and I'm sure some of it depends on the type of pant and even your body type, but if you think about it, even if there's only a several percent chance that your pants would take on water in a bad swim, when it does happen it's so bad that you'd never want to risk it.  (Life in a hydraulic is hard enough already, right? ;)

follow up to harms' post about kokatat bibs...

they work great. they have a tunnel that rolls up with your drytop tunnel then gets sealed by being compressed by the tunnel of your skirt. used the same set for six years while i've replaced drytops three times. even used them during the all day swims of rescue class. no water, plenty warm.

always wondered about the drypant holding water issue...thanks jay.

http://www.kokatat.com/product_detail.asp?code=ttp

I had this old dry suit with a big tear in the left ankle and I would just piss in my suit because I figured it would drain out. I found it odd that it always funneled down my right leg instead, pooling up and slowly getting cold. After several months of doing headstands to drain the piss out of my suit I finally sold it too Dave and bought a new one... best dang investment I ever made.

I'm glad you are ok Mike!  

If I ended up going, I woulda had a bag for ya Mike since I don't run that rapid anymore.  Glad you persevered.  Reminds me of Lotson's "pee zipper incident".